Reinventing Life And Space With Stephanie Jackson

Wendy & Rich 0:00
Hey, everyone is Rich Bennett. Can you believe it? The show is turning 10 this year. I am so grateful for each and every one of you who've tuned in, shared a episode, or even joined the conversation over the years. You're the reason that this podcast has grown into what it is today. Together, we've shared laughs, tears, and moments that truly matter. So I want to thank you for being part of this journey. Let's make the next 10 years even better. Coming to you from the Freedom Federal Credit Union Studios Haafer County Living presents Conversations with Rich Bennett. 

However

Rich Bennett 1:01
wondered would it take to rebuild your life when everything falls apart? Stephanie Jackson News firsthand, after her art career crashed and burned along with her finances and marriage, Stephanie found herself at rock bottom. But instead of giving up, she transformed her struggles into something extraordinary. In the ashes of her old life, Stephanie created practical sanctuary, pioneering a whole new field, sensory interior design. Combined in neuroscience, psychology, and art, she designed spaces that don't just look beautiful, they feel right. Her mission to help highly sensitive and neurodivergent people thrive in environments that truly support focus, healing, emotional regulation, and better relationships. 

Grab your coffee, whatever you're drinking, just grab it and sit down because you're 

gonna learn a lot about this. I'm gonna learn a lot, which is why I do this. This is I've never heard of anybody doing this before, so this is gonna be fun. How you doing, Stephanie? 

Stephanie Jackson 2:17
I am doing so well and thank you for that delightful introduction. 

Rich Bennett 2:22
Oh, my pleasure, but I got to ask firsthand, though, so the art career, what type of art career was 

Stephanie Jackson 2:31
it? I wanted to paint here. I was an oil painter. 

Rich Bennett 2:34
Oh, 

Stephanie Jackson 2:35
yes, I got a degree from the San Francisco Art Institute, which as a fellow artist said, educate feral artists or else, or they did educate feral artists, they no longer exist. 

Rich Bennett 2:53
Feral 

Stephanie Jackson 2:55
artists? Feral artists, yes, they did not teach us how to make money as 

Rich Bennett 3:01
artists. Oh, 

Stephanie Jackson 3:04
they just taught us how to trust our instincts and do what we were inclined to do and then defend it. 

Rich Bennett 3:15
Okay, they don't teach you that in business that's for sure. 

Stephanie Jackson 3:20
They should have had business as a component of that. 

Rich Bennett 3:25
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 3:26
Not. We were taught to distrust commerce. We were taught to live on almost nothing. That's a direct quote. Wow. Head of the institution in the introductory lecture. Someone hand said, how do we afford this? And he said learn to live on almost nothing. 

Rich Bennett 3:52
Okay. Well, you know what I hate to say, but I think that's with all the arts. 

Stephanie Jackson 3:58
You know, living on nothing is good skill. 

Rich Bennett 4:02
Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 4:02
it is. 

Rich Bennett 4:05
He gives you a whole new love for ramen 

Stephanie Jackson 4:07
noodles. Oh, I know a thousand 

Rich Bennett 4:10
ways. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:10
of one Ramen noodles trust 

Rich Bennett 4:13
how I learned to cook. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:16
Absolutely. You can doctor them up. 

Rich Bennett 4:18
Oh, yeah. Oh, I know rattlesnakes. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:20
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 4:20
Good. I don't know my question. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:23
So I feel that living on as little as you can is a good life skill for everyone. 

Rich Bennett 4:30
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:30
It allows you to prioritize what's important to you and not get tied into just 

running on a treadmill to. 

Rich Bennett 4:40
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 4:41
Going. So it was good advice as far as it went. It should have gone a little further than that. And I have a lot to say about that. 

Rich Bennett 4:53
Wow. I'm just. It's it's kind of funny in a way you think about it because look how many people I want like musicians. You know, they they go. Love them go to college to to perfect or trade and everything and they struggle. That's how you see a lot of them playing the bars and everything and play it playing the 

Stephanie Jackson 5:16
Oh, 

Rich Bennett 5:16
subway. 

Stephanie Jackson 5:17
oh, yes, any chance any. 

Rich Bennett 5:19
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 5:20
Play. 

Rich Bennett 5:20
I look at you know, professional wrestlers that talk about all the time, you know, they're times in the Indies. in their car. 

Stephanie Jackson 5:29
Living 

Rich Bennett 5:30
Just trying to make ends meet. It's a lot of people who realize there are some careers like 

Stephanie Jackson 5:35
career. 

Rich Bennett 5:35
in our 

Stephanie Jackson 5:36
It's 

Rich Bennett 5:37
it 

Stephanie Jackson 5:37
You have to 

Rich Bennett 5:38
and 

Stephanie Jackson 5:38
love it 

Rich Bennett 5:38
authors. 

Stephanie Jackson 5:39
more than you love security. 

Rich Bennett 5:41
Yes. Oh, yeah, yeah. So how long did you do that for? 

Stephanie Jackson 5:46
Decades. I was I was someone who committed to the arts at an early age and stuck with it. I went to school with a lot of people who were into arts and their undergraduate. Years and then they graduated and they hung around for about a year and then they went back to graduate school for MBA or an MD or a law degree. Because making it up as you go along as an artist is 

Rich Bennett 6:15
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 6:15
not for the week. Status is a really powerful attractor. Powerful motive. And I was not interested. I was getting my sense of status internally. And that's one of the things that pursuing that path taught me how to do accidentally. Really? I was I was just like, okay, this is what I do. I'm an artist and this is how I do it. I would just just keep keep making it up as I go along. But when things got really difficult when things melted down and it became clear to me that the arts as a world as an organization as a whole economy was not giving back what I had put into it. It was not taking care of me. And the further into it I got, I was living in New York at the time. 

Rich Bennett 7:20
Oh God, any cheap. 

Stephanie Jackson 7:21
It was not cheap. And I was getting a good behind the scenes look at the quote unquote New York art world. 

Rich Bennett 7:29
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 7:30
Which is museums, its galleries, its curators, its critics, its collectors. The more I saw behind curtain, the more I realized that it was not about the art. And that it was rigged beyond all belief. 

Rich Bennett 7:51
Sounds like the music industry 

Stephanie Jackson 7:54
Pretty much. 

Rich Bennett 7:56
and film industry. Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 7:56
Yes, it's actually even worse than music and film. 

Rich Bennett 8:01
Really? 

Stephanie Jackson 8:01
Because, oh, there are fewer art collectors. There are fewer people funding the art than there are people funding. Music. People are still buying 

Rich Bennett 8:10
music. Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 8:11
they're still watching film. There are not that many people going to museums anymore. 

Rich Bennett 8:17
That's sad. 

Stephanie Jackson 8:18
No, it is it's sad and to be to be honest, it's almost intentional. Because what I discovered is that the people who are buying and selling art at those crazy, crazy prices that 

Rich Bennett 8:35
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 8:35
you see that make you think art is worth something? They're money laundering. They are people who are using art to cover financial transactions that they don't want to have 

Rich Bennett 8:53
at. 

Stephanie Jackson 8:53
looked 

Rich Bennett 8:54
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 8:56
It is really not about the art. 

Rich Bennett 8:59
That's wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 9:01
And once I had seen that, I couldn't unsee it. 

Rich Bennett 9:05
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 9:06
And I could not, I realized I could not create a place for myself with some of my values in it. And I could not find a place for some of my values and frankly it's a pyramid. It was taking advantage of all the thousands of people who love to make art take it very seriously. Frickonomics did a podcast on that there are 20 artists that are represented by high end galleries that are buying and selling their work for high prices. When a new artist gets into one of those galleries, one of the artists gets knocked off. Their prices go down. It's completely controlled. And that's intentional. It is a completely unregulated market. And what is manipulating that market is not about the art experience. You go to a movie. You get an experience, right? 

Rich Bennett 10:10
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 10:11
You it affects you. It affects your mind. It affects your emotion. It affects your body music. You go to a concert. It affects you. You get this experience. You get this connection with other people. You go into a museum and you see some of this art. You're just like, what is that? 

Rich Bennett 10:31
See I 

Stephanie Jackson 10:33
(laughing) 

Rich Bennett 10:34
But now there's some people like myself. I can take, I can look at a piece of art. And I've talked about this several times. I mean, it happens with music, but art especially. I can look at a painting or a piece of pottery or whatever, and just pull out different things. 

Stephanie Jackson 10:56
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 10:57
And I don't think, it's sad, but I think there's not as many art lovers. Is that the right word? I don't think there's as many people that appreciate art 

like they used to. 

Stephanie Jackson 11:15
I, yes, I do, that does make sense. When you're thinking about art, you're thinking about, like for example, a Monet. 

See in a Monet painting. It's an object and it has what we would call beauty. You 

Rich Bennett 11:31
Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 11:31
have a response to it. That is what most people think of when they think of art, 

Rich Bennett 11:37
yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 11:37
and that is more or less correct. It's an object with aesthetic characteristics that have an effect. What you're seeing in high end, quote unquote high end, modern art museums these days is not that. 

For example, there is a piece that won a big prestigious prize. The artist is traded and they're famous. They sell their work for lots of money. 

Rich Bennett 12:12
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 12:13
And the piece was in the Museum of Modern Art last time I was there. You walk into an empty room, and the lights are flicking on and off. 

And that is the piece. It's an empty room with lights flicking on and off. 

Rich Bennett 12:29
What? 

Stephanie Jackson 12:31
That is the entire piece. There's a long essay on the wall, which if you read it, it has like lots of incomprehensible words talking about why this piece is art, and what it's doing, and all this kind of thing, it's very boring to read. And that is the art. 

Rich Bennett 12:52
Somebody with epilepsy better not going to the room? 

Stephanie Jackson 12:56
Yes, indeed. It should also have an epilepsy trigger warning 

Rich Bennett 12:59
it. 

Stephanie Jackson 12:59
on 

Rich Bennett 13:00
Yes, 

Stephanie Jackson 13:00
that's true, but art is all about danger, right? It's ridiculous, Rich. I'm telling you, it's complete B. S. 

Rich Bennett 13:09
That is ridiculous, I mean that? 

Stephanie Jackson 13:12
Yes, yes it is. 

Rich Bennett 13:13
Wow, 

Stephanie Jackson 13:15
Yes, so here I am all sincere. I'm really trying to create paintings that change human consciousness. This is my avowed goal. 

Rich Bennett 13:26
right. 

Stephanie Jackson 13:26
And I'm walking into this world of bullshit and scamming. Which is run by the kind of people that most artists are activists against. 

It was so crushing really to commit myself to decades of poverty and earnest desire to become better at what I do and earnest desire to create effective work and to get known for that. And just to walk into this world full of posters, and I'm (laughs) i-ge-elistic and stubborn. And it took me a long time to really understand that that's what I was doing, that I was selling myself for a world that was just not aligned with who I am. 

Rich Bennett 14:24
Well, I guess that really explains the starving artist. 

Stephanie Jackson 14:28
It does, yes. 

Rich Bennett 14:30
I always, 

Stephanie Jackson 14:31
uh-huh. 

Rich Bennett 14:31
Funny cause I mean with our lines called, we used to do art auctions. And I always said what we should do is a starving artist art auction because you're all, there's a lot of artists out there that aren't making the money. I've always, always wanted to do that. Because I heard of, I don't know if it's an association or what, called starving artists, but I've heard of other people doing it. If it's not an association it should be because that's re- I'm sorry, a room of flickering lights is not freaking art. 

Stephanie Jackson 15:03
(laughs)

Rich Bennett 15:04
That's a problem with, you got an electrical problem. 

Stephanie Jackson 15:07
You got it on the corner. 

Rich Bennett 15:09
You know, is this still...

Stephanie Jackson 15:11
Not like it's special. This was, this was back in the hot. I haven't been to the museum of modern art in New York for over a decade and a half. 

Rich Bennett 15:23
I guarantee you if an electrician went in and saw that they would... 

Stephanie Jackson 15:28
(both 

Rich Bennett 15:29
Whose lights would've stopped flickering right away because 

Stephanie Jackson 15:31
laughing)

Rich Bennett 15:31
they would've got tires that I got to fix this I can ask for 

Stephanie Jackson 15:34
(laughs)

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 15:35
permission. 

Stephanie Jackson 15:36
(both laughing) 

Rich Bennett 15:37
Oh my 

Stephanie Jackson 15:37
(both 

Rich Bennett 15:38
God. Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 15:38
laughing)

Rich Bennett 15:39
That's, that's sad. That 

Stephanie Jackson 15:41
It 

Rich Bennett 15:41
is... 

Stephanie Jackson 15:42
was, so that was kind of the pre-chrisis. I was aware that the art world was like this 

Rich Bennett 15:48
the--

Stephanie Jackson 15:49
at 

Rich Bennett 15:49
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 15:50
When I had my daughter and the economy melted down, like pretty much simultaneously. So I was in New York, newborn baby. I had the last thing I did before going into the hospital to have my daughter was write a check on my credit card to pay my rent. 

Rich Bennett 16:12
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 16:13
And things never got better because this was the 2008 financial meltdown. 

Rich Bennett 16:19
Oh, shit. 

Stephanie Jackson 16:22
Her dad was in the IT consulting industry and he was consulting mainly in the financial industry. Well, all of the contracts just evaporated. So by the time she was nine months old, he was working cash under the table, doing odd jobs at a theater for $10 an hour. And I was doing part time reception work at a spa for $12 an hour, part time. 

Rich Bennett 16:54
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 16:54
Our rent was 1,600 a month. We were on food stamps, we were on WIC. And the last thing that happened was that my car dropped its transmission on the new--

Rich Bennett 17:07
Oh God. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:08
Turnpike. 

Rich Bennett 17:10
Oh no. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:10
On the way to Philadelphia on Christmas day to see his family. 

Rich Bennett 17:13
Oh geez. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:16
So we get--

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 17:18
just had nothing but bad luck riding with you. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:20
Yeah. 

You 

Rich Bennett 17:21
(laughs)

Stephanie Jackson 17:21
It was the world telling me, you need to stop this ridiculousness. 

Rich Bennett 17:26
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:27
The New York art world is not the life for you and we're putting a stop to this. 

Rich Bennett 17:36
Wait a minute. The car broke down on Jersey Turnpike. Your husband and baby were with you? 

Stephanie Jackson 17:41
Yes, no, we were on our way to see his family in Philadelphia for Christmas. 

Rich Bennett 17:47
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 17:47
And a month earlier, his mother had taken me aside and said, "Step, if you need a place, you can always move in with me." And I was like, "Hell no, will never happen."

Rich Bennett 18:00
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:01
A month later, I took a chorus site and I said, "we're moving in." 

Rich Bennett 18:07
(laughs) 

Stephanie Jackson 18:07
(laughs)

Rich Bennett 18:08
Well, you didn't want to either. It's also a pride thing, you know. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:11
Oh, so much, 

Rich Bennett 18:13
I mean, 

Stephanie Jackson 18:13
so much. 

Rich Bennett 18:14
here you are, you were all going to be about becoming an artist and it's like, I don't know if it was like this if you were not, but like me, it would have been, well no, that's saying I failed. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:28
Right, 

Rich Bennett 18:29
And 

Stephanie Jackson 18:29
yes. 

Rich Bennett 18:29
yeah, I can understand why you-- 

Stephanie Jackson 18:32
Yes, 

Rich Bennett 18:32
Hell 

Stephanie Jackson 18:32
and--

Rich Bennett 18:33
no. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:34
Well, 

Rich Bennett 18:34
than--

Stephanie Jackson 18:35
it 

Rich Bennett 18:35
Is she a good 

Stephanie Jackson 18:35
was 

Rich Bennett 18:36
cook? 

Stephanie Jackson 18:36
more Uh, 

Rich Bennett 18:38
(laughs)

Stephanie Jackson 18:39
(laughs) let's not get into that. 

Rich Bennett 18:41
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:42
I love my, I love my ex-mother-in-law. (laughs) 

Rich Bennett 18:49
I'll just say, if 

Stephanie Jackson 18:49
And 

Rich Bennett 18:50
it's 

Stephanie Jackson 18:50
my--

Rich Bennett 18:50
good food, I'm moving in. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:51
Cook, yes. (laughs) I ended up doing most of the cooking. 

Rich Bennett 18:55
up--

Oh, 

Stephanie Jackson 18:56
I 

Rich Bennett 18:56
okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 18:56
ended Doing everything. 

Rich Bennett 18:58
(laughs)

Oh, God. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:00
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 19:01
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:01
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 19:02
All right, so the three of you move back in there and--

Stephanie Jackson 19:06
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 19:07
Have you give-- well, you're a part-time as a receptionist, but did you give--

Stephanie Jackson 19:11
Oh. 

Rich Bennett 19:11
For art, totally? 

Stephanie Jackson 19:13
Um, four a while. I did. 

Rich Bennett 19:16
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:17
I gave up calling myself a professional artist right off the bat. I had been supporting myself as a massage therapist for about a decade at that point. 

Rich Bennett 19:26
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:27
I had been doing enough massage to keep my lights on and 

Rich Bennett 19:31
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:32
spending the rest of the time on the art. 

Rich Bennett 19:34
The lights weren't flickering, where--

Stephanie Jackson 19:35
The lights weren't flickering, that is-- 

Rich Bennett 19:37
(laughs)

Stephanie Jackson 19:39
job. (laughs) And this week's an assemble artist at 

Rich Bennett 19:45
that. (laughs)

I just had to go to 

Stephanie Jackson 19:49
age. 

Rich Bennett 19:49
your 

Stephanie Jackson 19:49
(laughs)

Of course you did, that's, it's forgivable, Rich. (laughs)

Rich Bennett 19:54
Oh. 

Stephanie Jackson 19:54
(laughs)

Rich Bennett 19:57
So a massage therapist for 10 years, 

Stephanie Jackson 20:01
Yes, and 

Rich Bennett 20:01
and that's a--

Stephanie Jackson 20:02
I got to Philadelphia. I-- It was, you know, Philly was three feet deep and deep and snow that winter. I waited through the snow with my resume in hand and handed it to every spa in Center City. I had a job within two weeks. My ex decided, unilaterally, that he was going to be a stay at home dead. He didn't ask me, he didn't check our bank account. (laughs) This was, this was just, he just didn't want to work 

Rich Bennett 20:38
anymore. 

Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 20:40
And, you know, a massage therapist and artist 

does not make enough money to support a family of three in a major United States. 

Rich Bennett 20:50
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 20:51
This is just a fact. And I was a massage therapist and artist when he met me. I had given him no reason to expect that I was going to be the sole family breadwinner. but he just had feelings about working and decided that he didn't want to work anymore. And so he just hid in his mom's basement, played with his daughter. I did the bread-winning. I did the cooking. I did the shopping. I did the doctor's appointments. I did the school research. I did all the things. And he was a lovely older brother to his daughter. He played with her nicely. And he convinced that he's a good daddy because of that. So I'm in this situation. Anytime I say anything about it, I'm the bad guy, of course. 

Rich Bennett 21:38
Right

Stephanie Jackson 21:38
oppressing him. And I want him to die of a hard tack in all of those compelling arguments that people can make when they don't want to be held accountable for this. 

Rich Bennett 21:49
Mm-hmm

Stephanie Jackson 21:50
So I'm in this situation. And I'm just, okay, I just, I have to solve it. I was looking for better paid jobs all the time, of course. 

Rich Bennett 22:03
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 22:04
I'm in a major recession. You remember what that was like? There were not jobs out there. So at a certain point, I'm like, I have to learn business skills because I have no other options. I could go back to school except that my, my now ex said, I'm not going to help you go back to school. I thought I'd, you know, go get a physical therapy degree and that would be, that that was the shortest path to a sustainable income at that point. But that wasn't, that wasn't going to happen. 

Rich Bennett 22:35
Mm. 

Stephanie Jackson 22:36
So I went on the internet. I found some accountability partners. I started learning things about digital marketing. 

Rich Bennett 22:45
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 22:45
And to my surprise, that's actually really fun. It's 

Rich Bennett 22:49
Yes 

Stephanie Jackson 22:49
creative. It's, 

Rich Bennett 22:50
it 

Stephanie Jackson 22:50
I, 

Rich Bennett 22:50
is. 

Stephanie Jackson 22:50
I could use. 

Yeah, you know. Yeah, that's what you do. 

Rich Bennett 22:53
Yup. 

Stephanie Jackson 22:54
Yeah. So I just started turning all of my creative skills in that direction. And good marketing is about connecting with people. 

Rich Bennett 23:04
Yes. 

Stephanie Jackson 23:05
It's about being interested in people. It's about caring about people. And that was in a way the missing element to my art career when I was making art. I was just making this thing. 

Rich Bennett 23:21
Mm. 

Stephanie Jackson 23:21
And then trying to sell it. Well, if I can connect with people, and then I can help them in some way, they're going to buy, they're going to buy my help. 

Rich Bennett 23:33
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 23:35
And that's what Massage is about. And I love being in Massage Therapist because people come to me and I'm a highly sensitive introvert. I like deep conversations, I like solving problems. So they walk in and I say, "Where are you hurt? What's going on? How could I help?" And they tell me everything. 

Rich Bennett 23:55
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 23:55
And I do something to help. And they go away feeling better. Like, what's better than that? 

Rich Bennett 24:02
It's some fields, like that being a massage therapist, you see with a lot of people that do hair. It's almost like they're a therapist. 

Stephanie Jackson 24:14
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 24:15
And stuff that I've always said because when I got out of the Marine Corps, I went to Barton Academy and became professional mixologist. And one of the first things they told us was

You

it's number one, you got constantly keep your hands moving but listen to your customers because 

Stephanie Jackson 24:33
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 24:34
you're going to be almost like a therapist. And that's

I think that's something all those positions they need to teach people that. 

Stephanie Jackson 24:44
Mm-hmm. People need to be hurt. 

Rich Bennett 24:47
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 24:48
They need to be hurt, they need to be seen. No matter what you're doing, if you're

Rich Bennett 24:52
and they need to be responded to their

Stephanie Jackson 24:54
and yes. 

Rich Bennett 24:55
Well, yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 24:56
Absolutely. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 24:57
I mean, you could save somebody's life. You don't know that? 

Stephanie Jackson 25:01
Yes and it's often the throwaway thing. 

Rich Bennett 25:05
Mm-hmm. 

Stephanie Jackson 25:06
It's not when you're trying real hard and going to be the hero. It's just some random thing that you said. 

Rich Bennett 25:14
Yeah. Or a smile. 

Stephanie Jackson 25:16
Yes. Yeah. Smile at the right moment. 

Rich Bennett 25:19
You

or as a massage therapist, you hit that

not the proper way. 

Stephanie Jackson 25:24
Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, as a massage therapist, I'm

I'm tuning in to people's nervous system. 

Rich Bennett 25:30
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 25:31
We calibrating their whole nervous system so they're feeling like a different person when they get off my cable. 

Rich Bennett 25:37
I tell you, it's

and those of you listening, and if you've never been to a massage therapist, you gotta try it, especially if you have any type of stress or whatever, 

granted, I now, I don't go to

I go to the chiropractor, but they do the massage part as well. 

It's a big difference. Now, I will get

my wife will take the gun to

wait a minute, let me rephrase that. My wife will take the massage gun to me something. But it does. It makes a huge, huge, huge difference. But she won't listen to my problems. 

I'm sorry, go ahead. 

Stephanie Jackson 26:23
Hahaha. Hey, no. Two my professional you want. 

Rich Bennett 26:28
But you're not doing a massage therapy anymore now. 

Stephanie Jackson 26:31
Uh, I, I, I, I do a little bit and 

Rich Bennett 26:34
teach 

Stephanie Jackson 26:34
I 

Rich Bennett 26:34
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 26:35
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 26:36
Well, you're teaching massage therapy 

Stephanie Jackson 26:37
I am 

Rich Bennett 26:38
too? 

Stephanie Jackson 26:38
teaching massage. Yes. Community College of Philadelphia. 

Rich Bennett 26:42
Really? 

Stephanie Jackson 26:43
Yes. I, I want to pass on all my magic skilled before 

Rich Bennett 26:47
I retire. 

Stephanie Jackson 26:47
I need to, I need to coach the next generation. This is valuable. 

Rich Bennett 26:51
Alright. First of all, you've got a long time before you can retire 

Stephanie Jackson 26:54
Hahaha. 

Rich Bennett 26:54
and 

Stephanie Jackson 26:55
and 

Rich Bennett 26:55
and 

Stephanie Jackson 26:55
where retire from massage. 

Rich Bennett 26:58
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 26:58
to 

Rich Bennett 26:58
I 

Stephanie Jackson 26:58
be 

Rich Bennett 26:58
was going 

Stephanie Jackson 26:58
retiring from design for a good. 

Rich Bennett 27:00
I'll, that's one thing I said. I will, I don't care how like I will never retire. I'll be a hundred years old and I'll still be doing this. 

Stephanie Jackson 27:07
Same. 

Rich Bennett 27:08
Nobody will understand what the home saying, but that's okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 27:11
I will be doing some form of creative work. 

Rich Bennett 27:16
It just, it keeps you. I think keeping you busy doing stuff like that keeps you younger. 

Stephanie Jackson 27:24
Yes, it does. 

Rich Bennett 27:25
You know, and it's, I've known too many people that have retired and just decided they, they want to do anything else. And, 

Stephanie Jackson 27:34
boom. 

Rich Bennett 27:35
Next thing. Yeah, they died in no time. 

Stephanie Jackson 27:38
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 27:38
I had a good friend of mine. I was in the car business for years. He retired from it. I think he's busier now. And he's just volunteering his time, 

Stephanie Jackson 27:48
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 27:48
which is great. Yeah, but yeah, he is doing awesome. So I, wow, I, Holy cow, almost a half hour talking to. Now, I know you said you would stop painting. Are you back to painting now or strictly for your business? 

Stephanie Jackson 28:06
It's for my business. I really, I, I do a creative thing all the time. I mean, I, I have a house and one day I open the front door and the staircase case risers looked really blank. I could see them right from the front door. I was like, I'm going to do something. So I did a mosaic mural of my staircase risers. I have murals all over my house. I, you know, I, I garden, I do all kinds of creative things. And I do all kinds of creative interventions for my design clients. 

Rich Bennett 28:40
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 28:40
I'm also publishing a book this September 

Rich Bennett 28:46
well, 

Stephanie Jackson 28:46
called, 

Rich Bennett 28:46
God, I didn't even get a chance to ask that question. 

Stephanie Jackson 28:50
Yeah. I, I'm actually editing the book right now. And the book will also have images, illustrations. So, so 

Rich Bennett 28:59
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 29:00
I use all of my creative skills. If I get inspired to do, you know, a purely joyful, creative project like mosaic the stairs. I will, I know longer do it every day with the idea that I'm gonna show my work in galleries and sell it and, you know, become, you know, a known household name as an artist. I just do what I'm inspired to do. I don't have a, you know, I'm not like a machine. I'm not a production factory anymore. You know, like that's how they train you. It's like you're supposed to be, you're supposed to be obsessed. You're supposed to be doing this all the time and like not care about anything else. And I realize that that's a little bit of a con to the people who they, yeah, we can talk about that. 

I don't want to go off again. 

Rich Bennett 29:57
Oh, God. I have a funny feeling. You're going to be on several 

Stephanie Jackson 30:01
times. 

Rich Bennett 30:01
more 

Stephanie Jackson 30:03
It would be my delight 

Rich Bennett 30:05
and the thing is, you know, if you ever make it down this way, you gotta let me know so we can do one in person. 

Stephanie Jackson 30:10
oh, that would be so much fun. 

Rich Bennett 30:12
I, What is 

Stephanie Jackson 30:13
your go to a bar. 

Rich Bennett 30:15
All right. Wait a minute now. You're scared to be already. I, look, I have several of my co-hosts had suggested that we, that we do a podcast going to all the different breweries around here. I was like, are you guys nuts? 

Stephanie Jackson 30:30
tell me 

Rich Bennett 30:31
But, 

Stephanie Jackson 30:32
that would be 

Rich Bennett 30:32
fun. By the time we're done, everybody's gonna, yeah, this 

Stephanie Jackson 30:35
how 

Rich Bennett 30:36
is 

Stephanie Jackson 30:36
you have to really edit. You'd have to edit that one really well. 

Rich Bennett 30:39
Oh, no, there wouldn't be no editing because trust me, I would not be the one drinking. I would let all of this happen already. We, one of my co-hosts said, hey man, why don't we do a roundtable on living a fulfilled life? I said, okay. So it was five of us, five guys. And it was the afternoon. So he said, he suggested some bourbon, so 

Stephanie Jackson 31:06
my favorite. 

Rich Bennett 31:08
I made all of them old fashions. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:10
Yes, 

Rich Bennett 31:10
I didn't have any. I didn't drink. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:13
No, 

Rich Bennett 31:15
no, 

Stephanie Jackson 31:15
know. 

Rich Bennett 31:16
no, no, no, no, okay. Because when I went to edit that episode, somehow or another, his microphone got turned off. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:24
What? 

Rich Bennett 31:25
Yeah. So, luckily I was able to pull his voice out from my microphone and another one that he was sitting with me. But eight hours of editing. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:34
Oh. 

Rich Bennett 31:35
Yeah, Joe, I'm calling you out. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:37
Oh, 

Rich Bennett 31:38
but it was hilarious, but one of the he and when he coo, he is, he's freaking awesome. He's great. And one of the best episodes we've done. Even though his, 

Stephanie Jackson 31:50
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 31:51
yeah, yeah, it 

Stephanie Jackson 31:52
Tell 

Rich Bennett 31:52
was. 

Stephanie Jackson 31:52
me on the next one. 

Rich Bennett 31:54
Well, what I'll do. And I, we want to do it. And I say, we'll do it. There's a bus company. Well, I don't want to say it's a bus company. There's a day here called Hartford Brew Tours, where they'll, they got a bus and they'll take you to, so I said, we could do it on that and then hit the different breweries. I'm fine with that. all of us driving to the different breweries? No, 

Stephanie Jackson 32:17
But 

Rich Bennett 32:18
no. And there's somebody else, somebody else suggested that we do one strictly on bourbon. That's 

Stephanie Jackson 32:23
good. 

Rich Bennett 32:23
going to be a 

Stephanie Jackson 32:23
Whoa. I want to be on that one. 

Rich Bennett 32:25
All right. Well, I got an issue now. What's your favorite bourbon? 

It is hard to pick. 

Stephanie Jackson 32:33
It's hard to pick a favorite. Yes, it is hard to pick a favorite. Probably, I would say Bullet. It used to be Makersmark, but I'm, I'm a, I'm the fan of Bullet. The thing is I don't have the budget to try the really good one. 

Rich Bennett 32:50
Wait, what do you mean the really good one? Such as? 

Stephanie Jackson 32:53
Well, such as like the, the 

Rich Bennett 32:55
are 

Stephanie Jackson 32:55
ones that 

Rich Bennett 32:56
like a Pappy van. 

Stephanie Jackson 32:56
Two dollars of bottle. You know, Pappy family. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 33:01
But you, but here's a 

Stephanie Jackson 33:02
cap is like $35 bottles. 

Rich Bennett 33:05
There's a lot of great bourbon. You can get for that. And I think that's where a lot of people mess up with when it comes to bourbon, they think your most expensive ones are your best ones, and that's not always the case. 

Stephanie Jackson 33:17
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 33:17
I mean, like Pappy, Pappy Winkle is made by Buffalo trees. You can get Buffalo trees. A lot cheaper than Pappy, and Buffalo trees is great. Oh, grandad believe it or not. 

Stephanie Jackson 33:29
Really? 

Rich Bennett 33:29
Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 33:30
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 33:31
you get that. I think it's the, the bonded and barrel. OK. How do we get on bourbon? Anyways, I mean, 

Stephanie Jackson 33:39
There's 

Rich Bennett 33:39
and that's, that's probably about $30 of 

Stephanie Jackson 33:41
bottles. Rich, when you come to Philadelphia, there are, there's a, a, a, a, a, a, a, distillery called Ro House, the making, 

Rich Bennett 33:49
yes, I've heard about that. 

Stephanie Jackson 33:51
Bourbon, very, okay, I would say that's one of my favorites. 

Rich Bennett 33:54
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 33:54
The price you're one's I've had, but yes, I would. 

Rich Bennett 33:57
Oh, yeah, we, we, for a while, we are doing a beer bourbon barbecue group once a month, and everybody would bring a different cray of beer. Well, except for the one guy, he always had to have his corsories 

Stephanie Jackson 34:13
man, 

Rich Bennett 34:13
made. Ah, 

Stephanie Jackson 34:13
my parents raise me on course slices. 

Rich Bennett 34:19
And then we, everybody would bring different bourbon while my, my one buddy brought Canadian club. Oh, no, not Canadian club. 

Stephanie Jackson 34:29
Maybe 

Rich Bennett 34:29
this 

Stephanie Jackson 34:29
in 

Rich Bennett 34:29
guy. No, the stuff I used to snort all the time. 

Stephanie Jackson 34:32
What? 

Rich Bennett 34:33
That's another story. 

Stephanie Jackson 34:35
Crown royal. Okay. 

Rich Bennett 34:36
Crown royal. That's like, 

Stephanie Jackson 34:38
crap. Oh, okay, 

Rich Bennett 34:39
dynamo. Crown royal is not buried. It's good. It was the crown royal blackberry. Let me tell you something, that mixed with apple cider is very dangerous. 

Stephanie Jackson 34:49
Just horrible. 

Rich Bennett 34:50
Oh, it's awesome. It was great. 

Stephanie Jackson 34:53
Really? 

Rich Bennett 34:54
Okay. Oh, well, I mean, most of the stuff has, yeah, but not, and I just picked up the, um, Crown royal salted caramel. 

Stephanie Jackson 35:04
Mm. 

Rich Bennett 35:04
I haven't tried that 

Stephanie Jackson 35:05
Yeah. Okay. Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 35:06
yet. 

Stephanie Jackson 35:06
that's that overridescreen. 

Rich Bennett 35:10
Yeah. Oh, man. Anyways, let's get off the bourbon. I want it. I want to talk. I want to talk the, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I read it lips here. I want to talk about the business, practical sanctuary, because you're focused on it's sensory for nerve. Wow. Reddit 

Stephanie Jackson 35:29
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 35:29
lips here. 

Stephanie Jackson 35:29
Sensory interior design. 

Rich Bennett 35:31
Yeah. Man, what, what was it that triggered your mind? Say, this is something that needs to be done. 

Stephanie Jackson 35:40
It was the fact that things that seemed blindingly obvious to me are not being addressed. 

I'm a highly sensitive person. I didn't realize I was highly sensitive until I read a book called The Highly Censitive Person in the late 90s. And I was like, oh, I'm not sensitive. I'm strong and tough and badass. I took the little test. I tested 99% tile high sensitivity. 

Rich Bennett 36:11
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 36:12
Highly sensitive things like noise, acoustic chaos, glaring lights, flickering lights. of how you're dealing with that. The emotional tension. If someone in the room is upset about something, I will know. I will not be able to relax until I've decided what to do about it. 

Highly sensitive people are simply taking in more data all the time than the average person. And we have to use some kind of energy to deal with that. Whether it's deciding to ignore it, whether it's deciding to block it out, whether it's dressing it, we can't not be taking it in. 

My late brother-in-law, who was an architect, was on Yacht's Infectrum. 

Rich Bennett 37:01
"Okay." 

Stephanie Jackson 37:01
He was, A genius, he could visualize three dimensions in his head better than a computer. 

Rich Bennett 37:09
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 37:09
Amazing. And he had all of these quirks. He would take the batteries out of the clocks in the room because he couldn't with the ticking. 

Rich Bennett 37:22
Oh, wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 37:23
Take the tags out of his clothes because he couldn't deal with having the tag on the back of his neck. He couldn't look you in the eye, or he could, and it was very intense when he did. But he had to eventually develop a hack, or when he was talking to you, he'd look at the corner of your eye. So it looked like he was looking at you, but it was just too much for him. All of these things--I didn't realize he was on the autism spectrum for 

Rich Bennett 37:55
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 37:55
years. His sister, eventually, we figured out. And as an architect, he was incorporating the needs of his nervous system into the designs he was making. He would put windows up high so they reflected light off of the ceilings and that you get the outdoors in, but you wouldn't be making eye contact with people walking by outside. He had all of these niches in his room, so that you could be in one room, which you wouldn't have to see people who were in 

Rich Bennett 38:30
room. Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 38:30
this Who didn't want to. All of these different things. What I realized is that when I go into a place and there's flickering fluorescent lights that are humming, you know, 

Rich Bennett 38:46
I hate 

Stephanie Jackson 38:47
And 

Rich Bennett 38:47
that. 

Stephanie Jackson 38:47
there's visual chaos, there is acoustic chaos, there's all of these people and I'm just like, I can't be there. I can't 

Rich Bennett 38:58
frozen. 

Stephanie Jackson 38:59
I'm exhausted. It's exhausting. It is so draining. You're in a restaurant like that. You want to connect with people. I want to sit in a restaurant, have a bourbon, have a good conversation with people. If I can't hear you, we're done. Many autistic people cannot actually track a conversation with that kind of acoustic chaos. I have sat in restaurants with friends who are neurodiburgent they simply can't, they can physically hear me, but they can't track what I'm saying because 

Rich Bennett 39:35
and 

Stephanie Jackson 39:35
their brain cannot filter out the 

Rich Bennett 39:37
Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 39:37
background. 

Rich Bennett 39:39
too many things to focus on, it's kind of 

Stephanie Jackson 39:41
Yes, 

Rich Bennett 39:41
hard. 

yes. Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 39:44
So there are all of these things that are standard in how we're building buildings. There are standard lighting systems, usually really bright light bulbs pointing straight down or standard fluorescent fixtures with that flickering really harsh lighting. There is standard complete lack of acoustic baffling, like no sound absorption whatsoever. There's standard furniture, which is really uncomfortable for people who are neurodiburgent, like they will not be able to sit still, there are all of this like visual chaos in classrooms in healthcare. There are so many elements that make it very, very difficult for people to actually function the way they need to function in that space. If it's a classroom, it's visually overwhelming, it's noisy, 30% of the kids are just going to be completely overwhelmed, they're not going to be able to learn. Hospital, nervous system, heels. When you are relaxed, if you walk into a hospital and the ambient vibe is you are about to be tortured, are you going to be able to relax and heal? If you are in the intensive care unit with machine, beep, beep, and light shining in your face, I visited a friend this year in the ICU. They had her under a clean light and I'm like how is she supposed to sleep? Clean light in a TV, your body heals when you're sleeping, and they make it impossible. "All of these things about the built environment. Obviously causing. Stress, overwelm, over stimulation, can be changed. But it's not seen as a thing, or wasn't seen as a thing." 

Rich Bennett 42:03
When you mentioned the hospital and you know, even the doctor's office, is when you go there, when the first things they do, is take your blood pressure. Even if you take your blood pressure before you go, it's always 

Stephanie Jackson 42:14
Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 42:14
higher when you get there. 

Stephanie Jackson 42:15
Right, yeah, wonder why. 

Rich Bennett 42:17
Which 

Stephanie Jackson 42:17
Uh-huh. 

Rich Bennett 42:18
is one of the reasons they call it, but it's wow. Yeah, you think about it. In the ICU emergency room, it's, uh, a classroom, so I never even thought about all that. Even I would probably, of course, it's been a lot of times since I've been in a school and looked at, really looked at a classroom. But you have some of these schools which, um, now are strictly focused on kids with different abilities, whether it be autism, dance, syndrome or whatever. I guarantee you those classrooms are probably noisies. They'll got all kinds of stuff on 

Stephanie Jackson 42:56
them. Mm-hmm. Yeah, no. It's, it's torture. It really 

Rich Bennett 42:59
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 43:00
is. 

Rich Bennett 43:01
You just had to throw in the flickering lights, part, didn't you? I noticed. 

Stephanie Jackson 43:05
[laughs] 

Rich Bennett 43:06
Uh-huh. 

Stephanie Jackson 43:07
[sighs]

Rich Bennett 43:10
You're listening to the conversations with Rich Bennett. We'll be right back. 

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Stephanie Jackson 44:20
I? 

Rich Bennett 44:20
And 

Stephanie Jackson 44:21
Do 

Rich Bennett 44:21
businesses? 

Stephanie Jackson 44:22
this over zoom and Google photos. 

Rich Bennett 44:25
Huh? 

Stephanie Jackson 44:26
I can consult over zoom. And again, this happened during the pandemic. I had someone contact me who lives in Dallas and she's is definitely I want to work with you and I'm like, what's your end Dallas? And she's like, we'll figure it out and we did. It's actually not that hard. And in a way, I figured out more from working with people remotely. 

Rich Bennett 44:51
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 44:52
Because one of the things I learned is that when you have people take photos of their own space, they're doing a thing called framing, which forces you to notice things that your brain has been editing out. 

And when I would have people take pictures of their own space and upload them, we would just we'd meet on zoom. 

Rich Bennett 45:19
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 45:20
You know, take me around your space, show me your laptop or your phone. And then I would have them take photos, upload the photos and then we would talk about the photos and I'd ask questions and I'd make recommendations. But just the act of them taking their own photos meant that they were starting to look more objectively realized what they had been working around, editing out. And be able to see for themselves what needed to shift that they could feel better. 

So I was teaching them how to assess their own environment, use 

Rich Bennett 46:04
our 

Stephanie Jackson 46:05
own skills and not just going, so I'm the designer, I shall fix it for you. That's not my goal. My goal is to empower people 

Rich Bennett 46:15
right 

Stephanie Jackson 46:15
to create spaces that are going to be working better for them. So yes, I consult all over the world virtually, I consult with companies and I do go into people's houses if you're you know within, within probably 40 minutes to an hour of mine. And that's really 

Rich Bennett 46:35
So 

Stephanie Jackson 46:35
fun. 

Rich Bennett 46:36
another another word's not here. 

Stephanie Jackson 46:38
Well, I might make an exception. 

Rich Bennett 46:42
bet 

Stephanie Jackson 46:42
I 

Rich Bennett 46:43
you love it, I bet you love seeing like a new business or a new house with nothing in there is just a blank slate. 

Stephanie Jackson 46:52
I don't. 

Rich Bennett 46:54
No? 

Stephanie Jackson 46:54
Don't. No. Because the key is 

Rich Bennett 47:00
the people. Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 47:01
And the people have things they are drawn to. And it's five dimensional jigsaw puzzle, which is the people, the space, 

is what's going to... What's going to emerge out of that? Like, yes, I love a blank space. I'm like, "Oh, okay, yes. What would I do here? Well, I could do something great, 

Rich Bennett 47:36
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 47:36
but it's not about me." I mean, I left that behind in the art world. It is not about me. It is about you. It is about who you are, and it's about me being able to see who you are. Like, that's what comes listening and tuning into the other person and figuring out what's going to make this space work for you. That is exciting to 

Rich Bennett 48:02
What about as far as like a business, though? Like, let's say... I call you because a staff, I'm opening up a new business, a doctor's office, 

Stephanie Jackson 48:11
me. 

Rich Bennett 48:11
you hit 

Stephanie Jackson 48:11
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 48:11
doctor, Bennett. Okay, right. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:13
But 

Rich Bennett 48:14
I need some ideas, and of course, that's a brand new nothing there. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:20
Yes. Oh, I can supply you with ideas. 

Rich Bennett 48:24
Absolutely. Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:24
All day long. That is not the problem. It's the execution. Then. 

Rich Bennett 48:28
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:29
As a business, that's everything. 

Rich Bennett 48:32
All right, so after they do the execution, do they contact you afterwards to show you... Because I know... 

Stephanie Jackson 48:40
I'm encouraging them to send out emails, or extending your photos. I have clients that just will text me with... 

Rich Bennett 48:48
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:48
Something that they've done, some change. They'll ask for advice about a color. Should I get this? Should I do that? What am I doing? I love that. 

Rich Bennett 48:57
All 

Stephanie Jackson 48:57
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 48:57
right. 

Stephanie Jackson 48:57
It's an ongoing process. What I'm doing is training people in a process that then can continue. 

Rich Bennett 49:06
I always love feel-good stories. So can you share either one or two or three or four or 20? It doesn't matter. Feel good stories of people that you've helped. 

Stephanie Jackson 49:20
Oh, man. That's my favorite. Okay. So about a year ago, I did an intervention for an amazing woman. This woman has had many lives where she did amazing things. She's worked for multiple presidential administrations. 

Rich Bennett 49:42
Oh, wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 49:43
In strategy. And I can't tell you more. But when I would mention people that I admired, she's like, oh, I know him, and I'm like, what? How do you know this person's like, oh yeah, no, I did an intensive with him. You know, 20 years ago, wow. Okay. So this woman is amazing. And she has had her share of reversals as we all do. So she had a divorce from a scammer who got away with her money. Then had a business which was almost sent into bankruptcy by an employee who was intentionally sabotaging her, which she did not 

Rich Bennett 50:38
Oh, 

Stephanie Jackson 50:38
catch. 

Rich Bennett 50:38
god. 

Stephanie Jackson 50:39
She had to move a couple times during the pandemic because of untenable situations, people smoking, and you know, it was in the cities, but she couldn't get away. So she ended up having to move into a much smaller place and rebuild her life, her finances, her business. 

And she was in this small condo working, you know, seven days a week, 14 hour days. 

Rich Bennett 51:09
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 51:09
And through through video, she looked great. You know, she looked professional, et cetera. You couldn't tell. And she's like, I was like, oh, she doesn't need me. She's like, staffing. I need I think I need some help with my space. Well, I walk in and 

I immediately start moving things around like psychologically. She had created a space for herself, which is like, I am trapped. I am on the verge of despair. Like I must work all of the time. Like, you know, it just the walls were closing 

Rich Bennett 51:49
in. 

Stephanie Jackson 51:50
And she had all of these powerful pieces of art tucked away, like stucking corners in closets. 

Rich Bennett 51:58
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 51:58
And there was just there was there was pre-fab office furniture and there was art that was there, but you couldn't really perceive the art and all the furniture was crowded around to make a good zoom background, but it was claustrophobic. 

'All I did, I was like, 'Okay, we're gonna rearrange this condo right now.' We rearranged the whole place. I pulled a lot of the art out. I put the art in places where it was going to resonate. I mean, I run to galleries, I'm an artist, I'm like, 'You know, you need to put this here, you need to put this 

Rich Bennett 52:31
need to put this here, 

Stephanie Jackson 52:31
here, you 

Rich Bennett 52:32
you need to put this here, yeah'. 

Stephanie Jackson 52:32
It's around. Pulled out, she had a collection of antique quilts. Pulled out the quilts, stirred rearranging them, started hanging them. Rearranged the furniture, you know, created much more space. Um, rearranged the rugs into, you know, it's a, there were, we did things with color. And then I suggested two accent walls. We had an accent wall in her office, which was a blue, I had an accent wall in her bedroom, which was a deep rose color. That was it. We did not spend a penny except on paint. 

She called me up in tears. She says, Stephanie, I, you have helped me more in three hours than five years of therapy. I cannot express what you have done. It changed, she went to a meeting the next day on Zoom. She was able to set a boundary. She hadn't been able to set with someone who was not treating her properly. This is a part 

Rich Bennett 53:36
of the 

Stephanie Jackson 53:37
woman, but she had been hiding her power. And I pulled the power physically and just arranged her space so that she could feel her own power. And it was transformative. 

Rich Bennett 53:54
Hmm. 

Have you talked to her recently? 

Stephanie Jackson 53:59
Oh, all the time. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 54:01
Doing a lot, doing a lot better now. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:04
Certainly. Yes. Oh, yeah. We're, we're, we're actually pretty close now. 

Rich Bennett 54:08
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:09
Yeah. I mean, and, and thing, it's always a process. They're always ups and downs. 

Rich Bennett 54:13
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:14
But when you have that, when your space is telling you that you're a powerful person, 

Rich Bennett 54:20
uh-huh. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:21
It's easier to roll with the things that life throws at you. When your space is telling you who you are, 

you're home. You know, you, you, you have, you're safe. You have resources. We all need that. 

Rich Bennett 54:42
Have, have you worked with any orders, at all? Uh-oh. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:47
I, I don't, I have, refer those people. I have a friend who 

Rich Bennett 54:53
I 

Stephanie Jackson 54:53
cleans out order houses. 

Rich Bennett 54:55
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 54:56
Um, that's a, that's a heavier lift than I, 

Rich Bennett 54:59
yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 55:00
lay, do, um, I would consult with the people. 

Rich Bennett 55:07
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:08
That, it, it is a process. I think that you do have to have a lot of motivation. 

Rich Bennett 55:13
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:16
Because that's a pretty deep, that, that's like a lot of trauma in the brain. 

Rich Bennett 55:20
Mm-hm. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:21
and it's you're protecting yourself with all of this stuff. You have to really want to heal. People who I work with self-select, they come to me. 

Rich Bennett 55:36
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:36
And it's a collaboration. I cannot go and fix people. I learned that as a massage therapist. You can't fix anyone. Everything is collaborative. You can't sneak heal people. You can't just go in and rearrange their tissue and then they get up. Y'all are... no, that doesn't work. They 

Rich Bennett 55:55
s---. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:55
have to 

Rich Bennett 55:55
I 

Stephanie Jackson 55:55
be 

Rich Bennett 55:56
always thought I always thought I was unfixable. 

Stephanie Jackson 55:59
You are perfect as you are. 

Rich Bennett 56:02
Well, it depends on who you is. 

Stephanie Jackson 56:06
Perfect as you are. 

Rich Bennett 56:09
Yeah. Somebody was wearing a shirt that said that the other day too. I was like, I love 

Stephanie Jackson 56:13
that. 

Rich Bennett 56:14
You do speaking as well, right? 

Stephanie Jackson 56:16
I do. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 56:18
And when did you start that? 

Stephanie Jackson 56:22
It's hard to pinpoint a date. I think I probably gave my first talk in maybe 2014. 

Rich Bennett 56:28
Oh wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 56:28
But I've started doing it more intentionally. 

Rich Bennett 56:34
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 56:34
Yeah, I spoke at a design studio in 2019 and that was kind of like the start of the TED talk. I haven't actually done a TED talk. But... 

Rich Bennett 56:46
Yet. 

Stephanie Jackson 56:46
Do now. Yes, yet. But I do have some signature talks and I'm constantly tailoring talks to the audience. So 

Rich Bennett 56:55
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 56:55
I will be speaking at a conference on neurodiversity and innovation in October in Baltimore. 

Rich Bennett 57:02
Oh really? 

Stephanie Jackson 57:04
Yes, I'll be near you. 

Rich Bennett 57:06
When in October? 

Stephanie Jackson 57:08
Uh, October 24th in 25th 

Rich Bennett 57:11
at the convention center. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:13
I think so. Yes. I just just got accepted. I have to like more 

Rich Bennett 57:18
It's 

Stephanie Jackson 57:18
do. 

Rich Bennett 57:20
only 14 miles. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:21
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 57:21
That's only 14 miles out of here. Just saying. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:23
Oh, well, I might. 

Rich Bennett 57:24
It's 

Stephanie Jackson 57:24
I might. 

Rich Bennett 57:25
between here in Philadelphia. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:27
Well, I will let you know when I'm there and maybe 

Rich Bennett 57:31
we'll do that bourbon podcast. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:33
Yes. Okay. 

Rich Bennett 57:34
I, uh, we give recorded person, I'll make sure I bring to bourbon and, oh God. Oh, that could. 24th and 25th. But that's a Friday in Saturday. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:45
Is it, I think 

Rich Bennett 57:46
third. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:46
it's a 

Rich Bennett 57:46
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:47
This could be 23rd and 24th. Is 

Rich Bennett 57:49
it? Oh, 23rd and 24th. That's, yeah, 'cause, you know, weekdays easier. 

Stephanie Jackson 57:56
Yeah. I think there's a Thursday. 

There. Thursday nights are always a good day, good. 

Rich Bennett 58:04
I, I'm, I'm looking at your website here. I have a question for you. 

Stephanie Jackson 58:11
Yes, indeed. 

Rich Bennett 58:11
And this is, I'll, I, I'll believe me, I'm going to, 'cause I always like to ask people, they're especially that have been through some rough things like you have, what they do to help with their mental health. You do yoga, don't you? 

Stephanie Jackson 58:28
I do yoga 

Rich Bennett 58:29
and meditate, don't you? 

Stephanie Jackson 58:30
I meditate. 

Rich Bennett 58:31
sleep. 

Stephanie Jackson 58:32
I 

Rich Bennett 58:32
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 58:33
I bite, I dance. 

Rich Bennett 58:37
Wait a minute, what? All right. The yoga and meditation I figured, but you, you dance. What kind of dance? 

Stephanie Jackson 58:45
Oh, I, I did ballet from the ages of five 

Rich Bennett 58:48
no. 

Stephanie Jackson 58:48
to 17 

Rich Bennett 58:49
No, come on. 

Stephanie Jackson 58:50
or, 

Rich Bennett 58:51
Oh, 

Stephanie Jackson 58:51
do not do that anymore. Anything that I can do. I, I deal with chronic, um, ankle issues. So a lot of what I would like to do is not physically possible, which is why I do this swimming in the biking. It doesn't. 

Rich Bennett 59:07
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 59:07
Put a lot of strain on your ankles, but when I'm able, you heard of ecstatic dance. 

Rich Bennett 59:13
Harrier. What? 

Stephanie Jackson 59:14
Yes. Yes. It's a bunch of smelly hippies getting 

Rich Bennett 59:18
together 

Stephanie Jackson 59:21
and rolling around on the floor. 

Rich Bennett 59:27
Oh, God. 

No, I'm going to have to look that 

Stephanie Jackson 59:32
up there. Yeah. Yeah. No. You can go to an ecstatic dance pretty much anywhere in the world. That ecstatic dance playlist, still in mixed cloud. Basically, you get a great DJ, you get an amazing space. You get some, some lights. And then everyone just gets in there and just rolls around and rolls on top of each other and just, you know, expresses them tell with their body. It is the 

Rich Bennett 1:00:01
Just 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:01
light. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:01
don't have just don't have the flickering lights, right? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:04
And no flickering 

Rich Bennett 1:00:05
light. 

We said that the only thing I could think of is young Frankenstein. The movie, what was her name, Terry Gard. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:17
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:17
What is 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:19
that? 

Rich Bennett 1:00:22
Not that, not that kind of dance. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:25
No. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:25
Well, I don't know you say you're rolling on top of it. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:28
No, it's called contact improvisation. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:33
Huh? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:33
You kind of lean on someone and they pick you up. And then you just. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:36
Oh, now I know what you're talking about. Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:41
Well, yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:42
No, see if I tried that the person I'm. Would purposely move it. I would 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:46
my. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:46
follow 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:47
Well, yeah. That has happened to me also. I might have people lead on me and then just knock me flat. Like, and I just couldn't support their way. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:58
The 

Stephanie Jackson 1:00:59
unintentionally comic. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:00
So in other words, what you're trying to tell me stuff is that it's a slow moving mash pit 

Stephanie Jackson 1:01:06
is that's exactly what it is. Very, very well stated. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:11
Oh, God. Oh, wow. That hurt my head. 

Oh, okay. So something very important. Tell everybody the website. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:01:25
Practical sanctuary.com. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:29
That's easy. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:01:31
You got 

Rich Bennett 1:01:31
And 

Stephanie Jackson 1:01:31
to. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:31
that's how they get into 

Stephanie Jackson 1:01:33
practical. And you got to follow and sanctuary. Maybe I could have picked a slightly easier thing to say. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:42
Well, no, you just click on Google on your phone, hit the microphone and say practical. 

Wow, never mind. Don't listen to me people because I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. Listen to what Stephanie said, practical sanctuary dot com. All right. So before I get to my last question, is there anything you would like to add besides the bourbon sitting behind you? I'm joke. No, there's no. There's no Kirby sitting behind her people. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:12
Drink on the job unless it's her requirement. 

Wait, what's, what's your death, thermos, what's in that thermos, rich? 

Rich Bennett 1:02:25
I don't drink on the job. This is water. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:28
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:29
This is 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:30
water. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:31
Go the water. Oh, it is bubble. That's the brand. Yeah, because I use this and my niece got me one of those yeti mugs 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:40
or 

Rich Bennett 1:02:41
whatever. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:41
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:42
So I washed that. I tried to drink at least a gallon a day. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:47
Wow. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:47
Yeah, yeah. I 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:49
very 

Rich Bennett 1:02:49
am 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:49
well hydrated. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:50
Well, I started, so at one point I was up to 300 pounds. Yeah, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:02:59
and goodness. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:01
My older brother was diagnosed with diabetes and then my sister got it then my younger brother. And my back was always killing me. So I started doing a DDP yoga. I lost 50 pounds. Then one day I was going into downward dog and my back locked up, yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:03:24
Ooh. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:25
And I stopped doing yoga and I started putting the weight back on and back in January, I guess, or not January, June, last June or July, because I go to my doctor, you know, once a year, check up, get all the blood work done because of diabetes. Plus, I was stationed down at Campbell's, June, North Carolina, you know, that famous French water. And contacted me and said my A1C was high. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:03:55
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:56
And he said, basically, he told me I needed to go on a low calorie diet. Of course, I'm like, well, what the hell's a low calorie diet? And he's like, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:02
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 1:04:02
catch calories. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:02
no. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:04
So I found this app called NUM. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:07
Oh. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:08
And insurance covers it and I've been doing that. And since I started that, now I'm down to 235, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:15
wow. How do you feel? 

Rich Bennett 1:04:20
I feel awesome. I do. I, I feel awesome. And now the holidays come December that's going to be the challenge because I'm a professional Santa 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:32
Claus. Oh, 

Rich Bennett 1:04:33
that's, yeah. Seriously, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:34
we're padding this time. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:36
I, well, I am usually, I always wear a fake belly, but I think I might, I might have to actually get a fat suit. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:43
Well, huh. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:44
Because the pants and everything. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:46
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:47
And it's, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:47
Too big. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:48
it's too expensive to buy a new Santa suits. Those things aren't cheap. I mean, you can get cheap. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:52
Healthy. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:53
Yeah, I don't get the cheap ones. That's why I'm growing the mustache like this. I 

Stephanie Jackson 1:04:57
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:57
shave everything off right after Christmas, but I want to handle bar this year. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:02
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:02
So June 1st, I'll start growing the beard in. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:05
Oh, wow. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:06
Yeah. Hi. And the hell did we get. Oh, you asked me what was in my bottle? I was drinking. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:11
Yeah. So it's like you, so you're drinking a lot of the water really helps you sort of self 

Rich Bennett 1:05:18
monitor that. Yeah. Well, I've always, I've always been a big fan of water. You know, honestly, water's my favorite drink. Not bourbon. Water is. Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:28
um, 

Rich Bennett 1:05:28
And 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:28
you better. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:29
I, I, I always, always loved it. Uh, don't drink alcohol as much as I used to. Thank God. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:38
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:39
Of course, I haven't started barbecuing this 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:42
Drinking 

Rich Bennett 1:05:42
season yet. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:43
buddies, uh, now have new livers. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:46
Oh, it's. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:05:48
Yeah. It's, it's not, 

Rich Bennett 1:05:49
it's not. It's scary. I mean, we, I was just talking to somebody else that had on the podcast before you came on. I was recording with. And um, I told, I, I'm surprised I am still here today because of all the, when I was working in the night clubs, it was to the point where I always say I was drinking myself. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:11
Super. Ooh. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:12
Yeah. Because yeah. And all the 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:14
We 

Rich Bennett 1:06:14
others. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:15
not with diabetes. Like that's 

Rich Bennett 1:06:16
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:16
that'll, that'll destroy. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:18
Well, good thing is my A1C. I am no longer prediabetic. My A1C is back down. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:24
Good for you. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:25
So every time I hit a goal. know, the new mapway issue. Do you want to set a new goal? Do you want to sustain as like, because my goal is to get down to 250. I hit 250. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:37
Oh, 

Rich Bennett 1:06:37
It's like, well, let me go to 245 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:39
you 

Rich Bennett 1:06:39
here. Two for 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:40
you. Well, I 

Rich Bennett 1:06:41
And then 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:41
said, yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:42
I say, if I get down to 230, something in my mind is saying, maybe I can get back to my weight when I got out of the Marine Corps. And I was dancing. And that was like, between 210 So we'll see. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:06:57
and 220. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:57
Now I just got to build my muscle back up. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:07:01
So yeah, well, wait. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:03
Yeah, what was I, what was I? God, I forgot what I, oh, I tried. I forgot to my last conversation. I was going to answer. Is there anything you would like to add bottle state to decide? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:07:23
What I have to add is that you don't need money to have an amazing space. 

You have everything you need already. It might just take a little rearrangement. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:41
Hmm, 

hmm. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:07:45
I need to say that because People think of interior design as a luxury. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:50
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:07:51
..and interior designers market to rich people, and they market to sell a lot of stuff to market. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:59
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:07:59
The whole system is about that. It's about creating these beautiful renderings, and, you know, you just, you do this whole room with all the furnishings, and the finishes, and the extras, and all the accessories and things, and you know, you just sell this beautiful image, and everything has a price tag, and everything has a market. This is not what I do. I work with you, and I'm almost, people hire me for interior design, I'm almost talking them out of buying more things than I'm talking them into? 

Rich Bennett 1:08:36
Right. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:08:37
Because that's where I come from. I got my furniture out of dumpsters for decades. You take what you have, and you make the most of it. 

Rich Bennett 1:08:45
That's where some of your greatest treasures are found? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:08:48
Yes, absolutely. Dumpster, thrusters. You know, the sidewalk. Or...

Rich Bennett 1:08:54
Yeah, you're right. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:08:57
Yeah. Yeah, so it's really about appreciating yourself, 

Rich Bennett 1:09:02
and 

Stephanie Jackson 1:09:03
going back to what your own body is telling you, your own emotions are telling you, and then building from that, that is where the power comes from. And that is my mission to empower people, be more themselves, and to 

Rich Bennett 1:09:21
to 

Stephanie Jackson 1:09:22
appreciate their own superpowers. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:26
See, now you're giving me encouragement, and for those of you listening, we're recording on May 9th. So this weekend, except for Sunday, because Sunday's Mother's Day, so I won't do it on Mother's Day. Behind the green curtain, I'm going to... I'm going to get back to Framing. I'm going to finish this room. It's been too long. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:09:51
It has. You're a professional. You deserve a professional room. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:55
Well, I want a studio. But I mean, that's...

Stephanie Jackson 1:09:57
Bero, you wanna... well, you have a studio. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:01
No, no, no. No. I want a 200 square foot shed in my yard. That'll have... it be a studio with the beer... I mean, the water closet. 

The TV and everything else. So that way, when people come for recording, we're right there. They can have refreshments. I have a funny feeling. I may have to put a bed in there too, because I'll probably...

Stephanie Jackson 1:10:27
That sounds perfect. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:30
Oh God. All right. So for my last question, are you ready for this? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:10:34
As ready as I'll ever be rich. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:36
I don't know. Actually, I got two 

Stephanie Jackson 1:10:39
I'm 

Rich Bennett 1:10:39
questions. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:10:39
scared. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:39
Two questions. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:10:41
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:42
Any plans on... Because I mentioned the starving artist thing before. Any plans on painting again? Because you see, at least in here, you see art shows all the time. 

With local artists, you see, I hope I pronounced it right, like the plain air 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:00
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:01
thing. So, any plans on doing it again? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:06
No. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:07
No? All right. Then let me ask you this. Could people buy your art? Do you still have your old art? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:13
I have a basement full of art. I do. If anyone wants to see it, call me up. I really get more joy now out of collaborating to create amazing spaces. I really, really do. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:31
Boy, I'll have them more than two questions then. With that, since you have all your old art, and with you creating spaces, you know what your art is. 

What it can do, how it can help 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:46
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:46
people. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:47
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:47
Has any of your art going to any spaces where you've helped them? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:52
It has. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:53
Really? Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:54
Uncommissioned murals for clients. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:58
Murals. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:11:58
Avertive. Yes, so no. Like, yeah, that's a collaborative process, too. I mean, my massage clients saw my art and said, "Hey, I want you to do something in my space."

Rich Bennett 1:12:10
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:12:11
I don't do that anymore. And they said, "Here's, I'll write you a check." And I'm like, "Okay, I'll do that."

Yes. Great. And I love doing murals because you don't have to carry it It's 

Rich Bennett 1:12:23
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:12:24
just right there. And it's almost like dancing. It's about the relationship with the color and the form and the space and the light. And it's transforming the entire environment. It's like it's charging me. 

Rich Bennett 1:12:36
Uh-huh. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:12:37
I think the reason I don't really want to make paintings as objects anymore is that what I have always wanted to do is create transformative environments. 

Rich Bennett 1:12:51
Okay. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:12:51
And it is so much more satisfying to have control over all of the environment than try to fit it all in a rectangle. I just, I don't want to go back to doing that anymore. I want, I want more scope. And I also... (Ex 

Rich Bennett 1:13:09
sense) 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:11
Making art is a lonely process? 

Rich Bennett 1:13:13
Mm-hmm. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:15
I want to collaborate with people now. There's so many brilliant people out there. Architects... Designers, 

Rich Bennett 1:13:22
Oh, yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:23
other artists, uh, community organizers, healers, and there's this thing called an integrative design process where you come together and you brainstorm, what the project is called can-be. There's 

Rich Bennett 1:13:41
hmm, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:41
a brainstorming process called a sharet. I recently did a proposal to collaborate on a veteran centre in the- 

Rich Bennett 1:13:51
Oh. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:51
Islands. 

Rich Bennett 1:13:53
Wow. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:13:54
And, I, as I was doing this proposal, it's like if we can bring all of the stakeholders together, bring veterans and the locals and local artists and the engineers and architects and come together and say, what, imagine what this could be, what problems can we solve together? 

Rich Bennett 1:14:16
mm-hmm. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:14:17
Problems like, you know, Virgin Islands is hurricanes and, and there's limited resources because it's a island. What can we do together that's going to use all these resources to their best effect, and solve, how many problems can we solve? 

Rich Bennett 1:14:37
Yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:14:37
And we have to do this together. It's like, I don't want to be just sitting here by myself doing this thing. I want to come together with other people and collaborate to solve problems like it's a synergistic, you know, together we are more than we are apart. That's-that's what I want to do. I'm-I spent 25 years of my life alone in the studio making these objects, I'm done with that. I learned what I-right. Learn 

Rich Bennett 1:15:06
Mm-hmm. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:06
I want-I want my future to be more connected. 

Rich Bennett 1:15:15
Makes sense. I love that. It's one of the things I love about this-the one town down here in Habitigreece. You'll see a lot of artists will get together and they'll paint the murals on the buildings 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:28
there. Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:15:30
And they're recapturing the history 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:33
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:15:33
of Habitigreece. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:34
Uh-huh. 

Rich Bennett 1:15:35
Another friend of mine, Sean Fordon, he travels to the country. Don't do our murals, him and another buddy of his. And it's just, it's-it's amazing. And the funny thing is, you know, a lot of people would say, your murals on the outside of the building, oh no, it's just graffiti. No, it's not. No, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:55
Fillio, 

Rich Bennett 1:15:55
it's there's a 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:56
you've 

Rich Bennett 1:15:56
difference- 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:56
got to come to fillio rich. 

Rich Bennett 1:15:57
And, 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:58
It's- 

Rich Bennett 1:15:58
oh 

Stephanie Jackson 1:15:59
Murals. 

Rich Bennett 1:16:00
yeah. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:00
We're known for our murals. 

Rich Bennett 1:16:02
Yeah, you're seen it there in 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:03
Painting 

Rich Bennett 1:16:03
here a lot. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:04
went around the corner for me. It's stunning. 

Rich Bennett 1:16:06
Mm-hmm. I'll get up there. Alright, so what is the next big thing for Stephanie Jackson? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:15
It's my book coming out September 2025, The Accentric Genius Habitat Intervention. Fiery design for highly sensitive people. It is a manifesto and a how-to guide for understanding your own brain, your own nervous system and tuning your space to your own needs. 

Rich Bennett 1:16:41
Is there going to be a pre-order for that? 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:44
There may be. Check out my 

Rich Bennett 1:16:47
I 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:47
website. Practice? 

Rich Bennett 1:16:47
was- I was gonna say, if 

Stephanie Jackson 1:16:49
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 1:16:50
there-if there-if there is-let-let me know because one of the things- on my other websites- on my good news website, one of the things that I'm doing for my features of the week, I also feature a book of the week. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:01
Oh, wow. 

Rich Bennett 1:17:02
And, yeah, so a lot of my guests, what I started doing is featuring their book as well. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:08
Well, I will be sending you a copy. 

Rich Bennett 1:17:10
Oh, well, thank you. You can always just bring it down in October. I'm just saying. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:16
I will-I will probably-I'll have a chunk of books. I'll be speaking at a conference. I will-prov-I will definitely have some 

Rich Bennett 1:17:23
books. Yeah, well, you've got to get there, Perbin. Just saying. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:28
To look at, "Perbin is the verb it is not for every day anymore." 

Rich Bennett 1:17:32
Yeah, oh, I know that. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:35
Once every couple. 

Rich Bennett 1:17:35
Once every Blue Moon. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:37
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:17:38
Well, no, Blue Moon is too-never mind, Stephanie, thanks so much. 

Stephanie Jackson 1:17:42
Thank you so much, Rich. This has been so much fun. 

Rich Bennett 1:17:45
Thank you for listening to the conversations with Rich Bennett. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and learned something from it as I did. If you'd like to hear more conversations like this, be sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never miss a episode. And if you have a moment, I'd love it if you could leave a review. It helps us reach more listeners and share more incredible stories. Don't forget to connect with us on social media or visit our website at conversations with richbendit.com for updates, giveaways and more. Until next time, take care, be kind and keep the conversations going. You know, it takes a lot to put a podcast and together and my sponsors help add a lot, but I also have some supporters that actually helped me when it comes to the editing software, the hosting and so forth. There's a lot that goes into putting this together. So I want to thank them and if you can please, please visit their websites, visit their businesses, support them, however you can. So please visit the following Real-life real life prosthetics, cutting edge solutions, restoring ability since 2001 go to real life prosthetics.com Full full circle boards. Nobody does charcuterie like full circle boards, visit them at fullcircleboards.com, Sincerely, Sincerely, sincerely Sawyer photography, live in the moment, they'll capture it. Visit them at sincerely Sawyer.com.